Talk about harrassment.
A release printed in the New Jersey Herald, Newton, N.J., 9/28/08 Quotes Corzine as making the following statement:
Calling it a “real and present issue”, Governor Jon Corzine said Friday there probably won’t be a change in the state policy that prohibits a black bear hunt.
Corzine said the number of black bears was only a problem” If you want to call it that”. He then stood by Department of Environmental Protection’s position that better waste and garbage management will reduce the incidents of bear-human contact.
“A lot of the problem is perception,” Corzine said. ‘There are less intrusions” and most complaints are simply sightings and confined to a small part of the state.
The Herald noted however, that figures released last month showed the number of serious incidents involving bears were doubled this year over last year. In fact, all reports clearly indicate that this is the worst year of black bear problems including (56) house break-ins.
For complete, proven factual information simply surf back through this website to learn just how serious the New Jersey black bear problem is.
Governor Corzine’s remarks can be clearly compared to the anti-hunting/animal-rights evaluation of the bear problem. It was almost like having one of their representatives making the remarks.
A “small” part of the state? Only a problem “if you want to call it that”? Now this is a good one, bears breaking into houses, ransacking kitchens’ for food, killing domestic pets and livestock, posing such a serious threat to humans that mothers are waiting at bus stops to see their children safely off to school, tax paid for backyards no longer safely available for recreation, bear monitors on school play grounds to spot roaming bears, bear safety drills so children can safely be shuffled back into the school when bears approach the area, people carrying bear spray or other means of protection when walking dogs, gardening or maintaining their properties.
It walks like a wild bear, it destroys like a wild bear, it threatens like a wild bear, it poses a real threat to human safety, like a wild bear, yes you can “call that a real problem”.
If you will take a moment to read through the lines here you will quickly discover that Governor Corzine is “listening” to the anti’s and still ignoring the New Jersey Division Fish&Wildlife, state biologists and his (26) other fellow Governors, both Republican and Democrat, by the way that allow their professionals to determine the wildlife management policies of their states rather emotional liars.
Here is the problem in a nutshell; Politicians’ count votes and the anti’s have them convinced that supporters of a hunt are the approximate 130,000 licensed sportsmen in N.J. They cite this as less than 1% of the over 8 million N.J. residents.
Then they break this down to 130,000 trophy hunting, blood thirsty killers just looking to put a black bear rug on their floors or a head on the wall.
The anti’s have support from similar groups from around the country, groups that other than in N.J. have failed in their attempts to undermine the professionals of F&W, biologists. Therefore, N.J. is a sort of “last stand” for their ill advised cause.
What Governor Corzine does not see, is that the support of hunting is far greater than just licensed hunters, it has the backing of millions of N.J. citizens. In addition, Governor Corzine seems to shrug off “the small part of the state” Sussex County in particular, just for your interest a mainly Republican county at that.
The economy is as you all know in shambles; cuts are being made everywhere and sadly in much more important places than we would like to see. Yet N.J. continues to waste time and much needed money on this black bear issue.
To be completely redundant to my other articles, we have eight (8) years history. In the two years, 2003 and 2005 in which the state came to its senses and allowed a black bear hunt the following years the actual black bear intrusive activity went down. After each year of the cancelled hunts the intrusive black bear activity went back up.
This year 2008 after three (3) years of no hunting we have reached a “documented”, all time high, of negative black bear activity including the (56) house break-ins. All through these years garbage control and educating the public along with adverse conditioning of the bears has been in place and practiced. How many more years of experience do we need?
How then can a Governor make these statements even to go as far as downplaying the actual severity of intrusive behavior? Answer: He is being totally duped by the anti-hunting/animal-rights rhetoric.
Let’ face it does anyone really believe that Governor Corzine with all of the financial problems and concerns running the state really has the time to sit down and properly analyze the “wild black bear”?
His advisors and inexperienced DEP Commissioner, Lisa Jackson is listening to the loudest voices and those voices are those of the anti’s.
It took a near fatal accident for Governor Corzine to realize the value of seat belts and observing speed limits, we need to reach out to him so he can see the need for allowing the F&G, biologists to manage the states wildlife and we need to do this before another tragedy, like a human being seriously mauled or killed by a black bear takes place.
We need to tell him that we have a basic “human-right” to expect a safe haven in our own backyards and the kitchens and garages of our tax-paid for property, at bus stops, in schoolyards and public recreation parks and land. In essence, we expect and pay for the safe use of our property and the state is expected to take whatever action is necessary to insure that safety.
Since when is a problem in a ‘SMALL PART OF THE STATE” not really a problem? More important the problem is not confined to just a small part of the state as intrusions have taken place all over the state.
This is just such frustrating non-sense it is hard to imagine that any intelligent person cannot understand that we live in a developing state wherein the black bear population is thriving and going over the states natural land carrying capacity.
“Better waste and garbage management” will have absolutely no impact at this time in reducing and/or containing the black bear population or intrusive behavior.
“Janet Piszar, one of the anti’s funneling misleading information to the Governor and DEP stated this non-sense logic; bears are now forced to forever live in fragmented habitat surrounded by human environments’. If bear attractants: garbage, bird seeds, pet and livestock food remain and 40% of the bears are killed, what will prevent the remaining 60% from being lured by those same attractants?”
Janet Piszar, or her followers, if by chance you can read try this; stop misleading everyone before it is too late; you know fully well that if we reduce the black bear population through hunting by 40%, that opens up the thousands of acres of natural habitat for the other 60% to retreat to. Hunting then becomes “true” adverse conditioning as the “smart black bears” as you always brag they are, will associate humans with death, theirs not ours. It will not take long for the black bear to “fear” human contact and return to their shy, timid, non-intrusive behavior and now less occupied by black bear territory.
Legal hunting lands both public and private are close enough to developed areas where hunting will definitely impact problem bears. This is especially true in Vernon and West Milford where state land joins many backyards.
Legal hunters are not 130,000 as they have support to pursue hunting from millions of citizens in N.J. Twenty-six (26) other states including California cannot be wrong they just put emotions and personal agendas aside and place “human-safety/human-rights” before “wild, dangerous, intrusive animal rights”.
All supporters of hunting as wildlife management control; Contact the Governor, let him hear the truth from all citizens, we need to reduce the black bear population, hunting is the only proven method, hunters are actually agents of the state performing wild life management, bow hunters and gun hunters together are not the problem they are the solution; guess what they generate revenue as well.
Mike D
NJ Bear Hunt 
Pingback: Outdoor Activities
It is not so much that Sussex County is a “small” part of the state, rather than it is a “red” part of Corzine’s “blue” state!
By the way, has anyone else noticed that our Governor here in Alaska is a LOT better looking than yours in NJ?!!!
Pete, thank you for reading the blog and responding, I just posted another article today. Understand your comment on the blue and red state, agree. As for looks you win hands down, but more importantly your Governor identifies with the people all people and it doesn’t appear that she would let politics interfere wih a problem this serious. We in these black bear problem areas, with children and for me grandchildren too, cannot believe the actions like took place wherein the Governor actually travelled to this area to discuss problems then simply passes off when asked to give some real insight. He “thinks” from what he reads? Wow.
Mike D
The bears were essentially not here when I moved into Sussex county 30 years ago or when my family used to camp there when I was a kid in the 50’s(I unfortunately do not live there now). You hardly saw them in the woods and never saw the bears walking through backyards or breaking into houses. The only two bears I ever saw in High Point in the 50’s were Andy,he was in a cage, and the other was just entering the woods between Saw Mill Lake and Stokes off the road about 100 yards ahead of the car we were in. The population was basically well controlled and not encroaching into human habitat. It wasn’t until the late 80’s that bears started moving into proximity of peoples homes. This was due to the gross mismanagement of the bear population by the NJDEP. Before 1986, I would walk in the woods and never see a bear. After 1986, I never walked in the same woods without seeing a bear each and every time. The bears invaded our environment. We did not invade theirs. Bears are attacking people in NJ now. I have never heard of this prior this NJDEP debacle. One word in NJDEP is “protection”. I guess people don’t count in the Corzine/Jackson equation of “protection”. I have said this before and will keep saying it. It is irresponsible, negligent, pathetic and sick to put a bear’s life before that of a child or any person for that matter.
What is irresponsible, negligent, pathetic and, sick is the way you think. That bears are this angry big monsters that wants to eat your kid. That is how they solve everything in your part of town. If it is messing with us, we kill it! And that is why the world is all messed up. Bears might have not been were u lived 50 yrs ago but certainly humans did not live where bears use to live 50 yrs ago. Since we are building beautiful cookie cutter neighborhoods so that school buses can pick up your kids, we are also cutting natural reserves and food sources that bears need to give to their cubs. If you are hungry and cant find food for your kids and grand kids, wouldn’t you break in to a house to find it? There are better ways to fix the problem that by hunting bears. If you are too smart to throw statements around that you probably don’t know what they mean, come up with a “smart” way of fixing it. If not go get a big bear survival guide and hit yourself in the head with it.
A Real Danger
Hello,
I just wanted to take a second and warn and remind residents and neighbors of a real local danger not to be dismissed or taken lightly. I had a terrible experience today but very eye opening as well … I will spare graphic details but will tell you what happened in hopes that it may re enforce the fact that Black Bears can be very dangerous, they can and will kill if they are so inclined . Hopefully my experience can spare someone else the same images that I just can’t seem to shake. Black Bears will kill and they do it quickly and in near silence … they will also cross barriers to reach their pray multiple barriers and cross them skillfully. I have always had respect for wild animals as my Dad was a hunter and outdoors man and always taught us safety outdoors and respect for animals in general. However experiencing what I did today has left me with not only respect but a fear as well you hear about “things that can happen” damages that can be inflicted by animals … when you see it first hand wow its nothing like “knowing” seeing is just way more than just knowing, the images hard to shake.
Today I got a call from my friend , he owns the property I rent and where we keep our sheep . One was missing and one was dead was his report to me . Without being overly graphic a huge hole was in the neck of our adult ewe sheep she weighed over 100 lbs she also had scratches on her belly that were consistent with bear . … after investigation again without going into the ugly details , I suspect due to evidence found that our missing sheep is also killed although after much searching and tracking the killer for hours we did not find the remains as I said evidence points to his demise as well . The killer was a huge Black Bear without a shadow of doubt not only did he leave huge paw prints really big ones in the mud and snow he also took a huge dump in the paddock as well … he was probably given the size of the prints over 500 lbs most likely bigger . My friend and I tracked him hoping to recover remains due to the snow we had enough tracks broken branches and bear scat to track him quite a distance successfully however we did not find the missing sheep we found a thicket where it is likely the bear went with him but it was too thick for us to get through safely given the clothes we were both wearing … … he left my wonderful ewe in the paddock he killed her and left his kill that is a bad bear he killed more than he needed to eat and that is a bad animal that simple.
I know when you have livestock you take risk of sickness, disease and even loss to wild animals but this bear killed not once for food and left but twice much more than he needed to eat as he did not come back for what he left . At the farm where I keep them live some children all that weigh less than those sheep … think about it no one heard a thing he was silent killer and only a few hundred yards from their house the bear was so big he did not need to drag his kill he carried it no drag marks at all only evidence where he laid his kill over the fence climbed it himself and then picked up his kill again to carry it off …
My dad was a skilled hunter while I enjoyed training the dogs and laying tracks I could not go hunting and kill just could not do it , today I could have and would have without doubt killed that bear had I means and had I crossed his path plain and simple …. That is dangerous animal behavior not because I lost my nice sheep but because that animal is dangerous and he will be back I removed my remaining few sheep to a friends farm several miles away because the bear will be back, when he comes back if one of the kids were out might he re direct his attack … ??? I don’t know but I know I am afraid for my friends and their kids and their community … and it could be your community the bears are really out in great numbers in residential as well as rural areas , they have no natural predators they live and multiply in dangerous numbers in our society venturing out of their natural habitat forging for food that is not on their natural menu.
Bears are in a overpopulation in our area especially Sussex County but venturing further south down Route 23, I know first hand they have been sighted as far down as Wayne which is anything but rural. Usually they present no problems usually they pass on by and are beautiful and striking animals. I know that I live with them each day see them often but they can snap they can kill and they are dangerous very dangerous . When the land that is their natural environment cannot feed them properly any longer when there are more bears than natural foods they resort to garbage and or livestock . What is next as they live closer to us become more over populated and eventually in bred (which is dangerous for any animals genetics ) what happens next . If you saw my sheep’s body today you would be afraid of what could be next . Please be careful don’t take chances when it involves a bear and please do not assume they are harmless no matter how beautiful they may be no matter how cute the babies can be, hold a great respect for them and be safe around them , they are wild animals and they can and will skillfully kill . I will never forget the image of my sheep and what he did to her. If I saw that bear I would kill it even though I think they are beautiful and awesome animals even though I have some great photos of bears in my yard etc . Bears belong in the woods they belong eating their natural foods not our livestock not our trash. To date there are not many Black Bear Human attacks but as they enter our world more brazen and in greater numbers possibly in bred due to overpopulation could we be next on the menu ?? I don’t have that answer but I do know first hand that the damage they can quickly and skillfully inflict on a large living creature is deadly. Please be careful when you see a bear , please research how to protect your pets and livestock and self to the best of you’re ability so you do not have the image I have left to haunt me.
Donna Riley-Sweet
Vernon, NJ
I agree 100%! I don’t feel comfortable going outside or letting my 11 & 13 yr old outside. We are constantly looking. Forget about fun outside! There’s a Mom & 3 cubs running in my yard. You never know. What if we get in between & don’t realize until it’s too late. The population has to be controled. You can’t live with them. I’m afraid to leave my windows open. I went in the woods for my garbage can not realizing how dangerous that was. I want to enjoy my yard & the woods around me.
Debbie
West Milford, NJ
Hi Debbie, thank you for reading my blog and responding. I know that there are thousands of N.J. residents that feel the same as you. In my travels I meet them and they express the same concerns. Even when I meet people that start out quoting the animal-right and anti-hunting groups it doesn’t take long for them to understand the logic behind hunting as a wildlife management tool.
You know they (anti’s) can fool politicians, well! really not fool them just keep them wondering about votes they may lose by supporting our profesional F&W biologists.
They (anti’s) can even fool the newspapers, well! not fool them just pick the anti-hunting newspapers who are willing to publish misleading articles from these groups.
They (anti’s) can fool people from places like Hudson County and Manhattan where they have no real black bear issues.
But every misleading article they have printed, every “boiler-plate” e-mail they have their groups flood the Governors’ office with are all made “bogus” by none other than the black bears themselves.
Complaints are up and have been rising steadily since 2007 the second year after the last hunt in 2005. Twenty-seven other states with large black bear populations successfully use hunting to maintain a black bear population that does allow safe co-existence with humans and get this after culling thousands of black bears they still maintain “healthy” black bear populations.
Surley every so often in hunted states you may hear of some black bear roaming into a development or congested area. Just imagine however, how many more would be roaming around if not for hunting management?
Then you have to wonder just how off track these anti’s are? Just plain common-sense let’s us know that it is absoulty impossible to let a wild animal continue to grow it’s population beyond the available natural habitant.
Even the growing geese population has become a problem, causing the closing of parks and beaches, and now they allow stomping out eggs and extending the hunting season to reduce their numbers.
So why not the bears? they look cute, they are majestic, they were almost extinct; true, true and true but they will remain cute, remain majestic and never, never become extinct because it is our NJF&W they saved them and it will be up to them to continue with their successful management. Look at the healthy populations in the (27) states in which they are hunted.
What they will become if not hunted is more dangerous because “garbage-control” is no longer the problem, lack of natural habitant and food is the problem and as the numbers grow they will have no choice but to invade human space more amd more. Garbage can breakins will be replaced by house breakins,(as has already increased drastically each year) visiting porches at night will happen in daylight and like a human looking for food to prevent starvation there will be no safe boundries.
The black bear is big, strong and not afraid of humans, why should they be, a few pots banging together, an air horn and maybe a load of “rubber-buckshot” once in awhile.
The politicians have to back out and allow the F&W to do their jobs, they have to take a look at how effective this has been for decades in all the other states and they have to realize that failure here leads to endangering human safety.
This is not a “trophy-hunting” blood thirsty hunters battle, it is Moms’ like you, grandparents, it is people that love people against groups that use the black bear as part of an anti-hunting platform and are willing to put animals before humans.
Thank You Again and tell your family and friends to try and let the Governor and DEP and your representatives know how you feel.
Mike D
Donna, thank you for your very factual and important comments. Sorry, just returned from a business trip and did not have access to the website so couldn’t respond until today.
We had friends in Andover, NJ who raise sheep and are actually involved in the State Fair Sheep judging etc. We boarded horses with her and a few years ago a black bear just simply killed three of her prize sheep and left them there. The state Wildlife biologists indicated that this bear was not interested in food just killing as he did not consume any of the sheep. There were tracks all over and it was no doubt a large black bear.
As you clearly indicated they are dangerous. Problem is the animal rights/anti-hunters has lulled some of the public and most of the politicians into a false sense of security by using the fact that no human in NJ has been killed by a black bear attack.
It is just plain common-sense that there increased presence in and around communities that include house breakins, garage, breakins, attacks on domestic pets and livestock and in fact attacks on humans is leading the public right into a tradegy, a human finally being seriously mauled and/or killed by a black bear.
There is no room for overpopulation of black bears in an increasing population of humans and in particular children.
Please look for my next article in the next week and thank you so much for the response, be carefull and stay safe.
Mike D.
HI Again …
Well two nights after the bear killed my two sheep it killed a goat a short distance away from where I had my crew. Now about a month later it broke the window of the chicken coup last night the same bear the track is nearly the same and it is huge. I sent a letter to Governor Corzine complete with a graphic photo of my dead sheep the bear left behind if nothing else someone opened it and lost their lunch not expecting what it looked like I am sure. Fish and Game are very supportive they set a trap for a couple weeks but the bear is to smart I even bated it with doughnuts, honey, tried a bbq pork roast you name it i tried it the bear is not going in that trap he is to smart , fish and game removed the trap and a couple days thereafter the bear was back !!! He has never really left we have seen scat and downed brush he is not going far he has found food… Fish and game are bringing the trap back again but the bear is not going to go in it he is going to keep trying to kill our stock its that simple . This is a dangerous animal and sooner or later its gonna hurt a person or worse.. The land owners on the farm i rent are afraid to let their kids out to play and afriad to go out themselves although they still hafe to . If this was someones Dog a Pit or Rottie killng like this it would have paid with its life already why is a bear allowed to do this ?? what is wrong with people what will it take for them to wake up … A human death or severe injury is what it will take we all know that is what it wil ltake don’t we … It will be some elderly person who falls on the way to get mail or a kid who tries to defent a attack on its pet goat, or sheep or chicken … it will happen. All those Bear Huggers should look at the photo of my nice old ewe with her lamb last year and the photo of her slain this past month and see how they like that reality … I feel so helpless something has to be done a Bear Hunt is So necessary . frustrated and concerned yet again.
Donna
All the hysteria on bears is not warranted by the facts.The killing of livestock can be prevented by installation of an electric fence.At Tractor supply the cost is probably less than 10 pounds of organic cheese.The whole garbage problem would not exist if people used bear proof cans sold by the NJ DEC.When I run into people who have problems, they say “they don’t work” but they have never tried them.They don’t want to spend the $75. The parents standing at the school bus stops ARE PROTECTING THEIR KIDS FROM CHILD MOLESTERS- THE HUMAN KIND. There has never been a human killed in the state of New Jersey since records began being kept in 1900. Countless children have been mauled and/or killed in that time period by dogs,molesters and unfortunately their own parents.
Bring in the hunters and you soon will know what real danger is.In Sullivan County last winter a 16 month old baby was killed in its own crib by a nyc hunter
taking a running shot at a deer. The bullet went right through the bedroom wall. A 50 yr old Washington woman was shot on a hiking trail while bending over tying her shoe. She had a black back pack on and the hunter thought she was a bear.Satistically hunting will bring the “accidents” that go with it, to “prevent” the tradjedies that might or may never occur. If you want to objectivly know the facts on bears go to http://www.bear.org. It is Lynn Rogers site, a man who has researched bears for over 30 years. People who want to hunt should use the argument that it is their second amendment right. Not try to scare the hell out of soccer moms with outright lies and fear tactics. Anyone who is really a hunter knows that these are timid animals that run at your very approach. Why else would they mask their human oder with various animal scents etc.. Joe
Hi Joe, thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts. Unfortunately Joe, I have to disagree with your logic.
Let’s start with the cost and use of electric fences as compared to, as you stated, (10 lbs of organic cheese) The highest priced organic cheese I know of is from Bobolink Dairy, just outside of Vernon, N.J. it is $21.00 a lb. I can assure you, since I buy there, that this is not the norm for food shoppers who can buy supermarket cheese for a quarter of that price, of course, nowhere near the same quality,taste, health, whatever, but never-the-less more affordable for the average family.
So at $21.00 a lb that would amount to $210.00 dollars for (10-lbs).
There is no way a farmer is putting in electric fencing for $210.00 dollars unless he has an “ant-farm”
As an example; for electric fencing you need; fence posts, gates, electronic or even solar powered control boxes, post connectors, wire insulators and the cable.
Posts average between $5.00 to $10.00 each, depending on thickness and length, the control boxes $150.00 each, connectors $40.00 per one hundred, you need (3) to (4) for each post and the wire about $35.00 for 100 feet and installation time and or outside costs.
Do the math Joe.
Even the manufacturers of the garbage cans call them “bear-resistant” not “bear-proof”, they do not always work. For that matter and as I have stated in many of my op-eds, some ammonia sprinkled over paper towels with a one inch hole drilled in the top of a garbage can lid will do the trick. That would cost about $15.00 a year. This is no longer about garbage, it is about overpopulation.
Parents standing at the school bus stops are protecting their children from child molesters-the human kind? There has never been a human “killed” in N.J. since collecting of records began in 1900?
Here you go again; from 1900 to approximately 1997 the bear populaton steadly increased along with land development. Aproximately 1997-2009 and especially 2006, 2007,2008 and now 2009, after two successful hunts in 2003 and 2005 had brought complaints back down, overpopulation once again has led to increased, substantiated complaints of, house breakins, attacks and killing of both domestic pets and livestock.
From 1900 until the times listed above there were not enough bears to cause problems and a lot less development of land to disturb their natural habitant. So what good are records for periods of time when we had less of a bear and humnan population and more undeveloped land?
You sight a hunter accidentally killing a (16) month old child with a stray bullet,totally unacceptable, but neglect to mention a black bear just over the N.J. border that removed an infant from a baby carriage just a few feet from the front door of a cabin and killed that infant shortly therafter,totally unaceptable as well. By the way, please do not give me the “they hunt New York and look what happened story” because if not for N.Y. hunting and culling the black bear population just how many other bear killings would have taken place?
Thankfully, the vast majority of parents in this country do not molest or kill their children.In bear country parents are out there at bus stops to help protect their children from this now “overpopulated” black bear; the same way that the local schools now do with playground monitors, warning bells and practice drills that have in fact been used in getting children off of the schoolyards and into the safety of the building as these bears roam and threaten the areas.
Lynn Rogers is a bear researcher and “entrepreneur” who has earned money from black bears. Read my oped titled; “Doctor Lynn Rogers and Bears in the Myth”.
Here again, people get the idea that they can take a “wild-animal” as big and dangerous as a bear and somehow find a way to co-exist with them. Experienced people, like Lynn Rogers, have developed techniques that allow them to work within their own selected environment. This includes by the way, feeding stations and foods that include a variety of wild and “supplemental foods. You can bet that Lynn Rodgers is not recommending that people go out and try to communicate with bears as he attempts.
In the state of Minnesota, where Lynn Rogers practices, they use bear hunting to control the population. From 1987 through 2008 hunters have harvested “65,494” black bears while still maintaining a “healthy black bear population” of which Lynn Rogers can still study.
Scare the hell out of soccer moms? Well the most famous soccer Mom I know of is Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, who actualy hunts and doesn’t seem too scared of bears. Moms are protectors, in the wild they are the hunters in human life get between one and her young, it will be some fight. The difference, a human can better determine what may harm their children while a wild animal, especially a bear just doesn’t, get in between her and the cubs even though you may not even know you have done so and you are in danger.
Using lies and fear tactics? No Joe, I use actual, proven and recorded facts. It is the anti-hunting and animal-rights groups that not only disregard “second-amendment” rights but use misleading lies and facts to dupe the public into thinking that we can allow a black bear population to simply increase without culling them to a safe, co-existing number.
Here are some often repeated facts, out of (27) states, including Minnesota, home of Dr. Lynn Rogers, with large black bear populations, only New Jersey is caught up in a political web of anti-hunting/animal-right non-sense that has now allowed the black bear population to increase to dangerous levels.
Joe, if(26) other states have successfully used hunting, the only proven method of wildlife management,to cull thousands of black bears while still maintaining healthy populations that pose “less” of a threat to humans why should N.J. be different?
Answer; Politicians and their zest for votes have allowed the nationwide defeated efforts of anti-hunting/animal-rights groups to remain alive in N.J.
Safety is all about education and preparation. We can learn about black bears but education and garbage control will not prepare us to cope with these overpopulated “wild unpredicitable animals” simply being allowed to multiply to numbers that make it impossible to safely live with.
This is where we are “right-now” and supporting hunting is not about hunters and second-amendment rights it is about reading warning signs and prevening tradegies before they happen.
Lastly; bears are not “Timid” they are smart. When hunted they use senses of smell and hearing to detect danger. Once danger is known they don’t “run” they quickly, smartly exit to safety.
Timid does not describe overpopulated bears, smart applies here as well. They are not hunted in N.J., they see humans with bells and whistles, pots and pans and to them this is entertainment, soon they will dance for us, that is just before they break into our houses and property to take whatever they want.
This equates to taking away our police and everytime a criminal wants to steal or kill, we can try banging pots together, that will send them running, right?
These are warranted facts not hysteria Joe so try to understand and help explain to others before we find more tragedes to support facts.
All we need is a degree in “common-sense” to show us that there is no way N.J. can allow the black bear population to continue to grow. Housing, stores, movies, schools, roads, buildings, parks, etc can only support a specifc number of people before the “no-vacancy”, “no-parking”,”no-seats” signs go up.
For N.J. the signs read “NO MORE BLACK BEARS”
Mike D
Hi,Must give you credit for posting my article and responding. First:my math.A half mile of electric wire at Tractor Supply is $44.99. Check their website.There is a store right in Sussex and you’ll get to meet the beautiful mgr: Karen. I’D say that to put up a small 1/2 acre corral you’d need 30 posts.I
prefer to use my own cedar posts and nail in plastic insulators but I know these trees are dying out in New Jersey due to a fungus. Tractor supply sells plastic posts for the electric insulators for 1.29.
I said I’d use 30, so thats 38.70. Now the insulators, a bag of 25 is 2.99. For 30 posts we need a hundred.Four bags are less than 12.00. The cheapist power pac needed for a half acre is $65.00. Total cost of fence 163.68. Security in knowing your stock is safe: priceless.Now, lets not quibble about prices. The truth of the matter is that if you’re raising livestock they are a prerequisite. Bears or no bears.There are loose dogs,foxes,and now coyotes.
Anyone staking a baby goat to a tree is asking for trouble. I learned this the hard way. I moved to the country 20 years ago. Like all new arrivals I wanted to be a farmer. I bought a baby goat, and sheep. I locked them in a small barn at night and let them run loose by day. The neighbors black lab attacked my lamb and I managed to get out there not a second too soon.I learned the value of a good fence. The lab was actually a nice dog but was attracted by the smell of the oIL in the lambs wool. Now lets get on to more important issues.If you want to win your debate you must persuade people with logic. You tend to personally attack everyone who who doesn’t beat your drum.For instance, Lynn Rogers. Heres a man you know nothing about. You only know that B.E.A.R posts his picture on their website(Without his knowledge by the way)You call him an “entreprenur who runs a bed and breakfeast.” If I was him I’d sue you for slander. Lynn however is more tolerant.Lynn is a scientist who has researched bears for 30 years.He has used his life savings and even sold his Federal Pension to build the North American Bear Institute to educate people about bears.What you don’t know is he is NOT OPPOSED to hunting!He educates the public on bears in the suburban environment He also takes NO POSITION on the NJ Bear hunt. He himelf has hunted,eaten and enjoys wild game.He just doesn’t hunt bears,however.
He conducts a 3 day class for a donation that is used to feed his research bears and finance the institute.
This is what you called a “Bed and Breakfeast”. These classes are attended by Federal employees,such as Fish and Wildlife,Policemen,and private citzens such as NJ B.E.A.R. And Guess what? Hunters. Yes Hunters.
They go there to learn how to become better Hunters.
They learn tracking and The various plants that bears eat.
The research Lynne does aids hunters by maintaining a healty bear population and increases hunter saftey with an undestanding of bear behavior.For instance understanding that a “Bluff Charge” is not a bear attack and that the bear will stop several feet in front of you could stop a hunter from shooting where he he may endanger his companions or others.
Lynn is the first researcher to collar a bear without the aid of tranqualizers. That method was responsible for the death of numerous bears who stumble off half dazed and have actually drowned etc.. It is also dangerous for the researcher who must confront a drugged up bear. This is the reason Lynn feeds bears.
To enable him to collar them, weigh them and research them. You are mistaken when you make the unsubstantiated claim that he does this to create an “open zoo”. Lynn was also asked to study the Bear incident in the Catskills where the infant was killed.
Nothing like this ever happened before in New York. This was only the second fatality in NY History. There have been 2 homicides in a hundred years in a state with 200,000 people/bear interactions anually.Lynn concluded that the bear was a yearling who had no previous understanding of humans and was hunting fawns.The baby was left unattended in the carriage with a bottle of milk.Lynne has also done a voluminous study of why bears kill fawns, since the bodies are often found un eaten. His conclusion is that they are attracted to the smell of the colustrom(first milk) in their stomachs since they lick out the colostrum after killing the fawn.As you acknowledge hunting did not save the child.It will also not guarante freak incidents like this will never again occur.Perhaps Lynns research will. His research also shows that the States that have bear fatalities are states with low people populations such as Utah with 9. These have occured in remote areas where bears/people have little or no contact. It is the bears in these remote areas that pose a bigger danger to people not the garbage can bears.
If You pick any book out of the library about bears you will usually find Lynn Rogers mentioned as one of the foremost bear biologists.When you paint him as some sort of whacko PETA Flim flam man you lose credability and damage your cause. Hunting as well as education can coexist. You can also hurt your cause by overexageratting the danger posed by bears.It may backfire. After all if they are such a threat then the only way we could have guaranteed saftey would be extermination, and I know you wouldn’t want that.JOE
Hi Joe, I have no problem posting anybodies comments. I too shop in tractor supply, do not pay attention to any particular sales person or manager all are helpful at that store. Having horses I know of fencing. Your math is still wrong because what you are listing is an inadequate fencing that would serve as no real deterent to a black bear nor be considered long-term and safe for holding in livestock, like cows or horses. In addtion, farmers, many from which we purchase hay, with hundreds of acres of land and livestock are not going to invest in electric fencing.
Why should they when a hunting season, like takes place in(26) other states, solves 99% of the problems.
Hurt my cause by overexaageratting the danger posted by bears? Do you read papers? So far this year (6) bears have been shot as catagory (1) serious, the overall catagory (1) bears are at (42) up from (33) last year for the same time period. Overall bear-related calls grew from 307 in 2008 to 396 same time period 2009. The catagory (1) bears this year include real, not bluff, charges at people.
Don’t downplay this Joe because we are looking at a serious problem, backed up with actual incidents.
You know it is enjoyable to share information and ideas with anyone and usually if you read the majority of replies to my opeds the exchanges with few exceptions are fair, even if thoughts differ.
In your case you opened this reply in a good tone then drifted right into a major downturn when you go off with comments like “I personally attack everyone who doesn’t beat to my drum”, or here is the best, ” If I was him (Lynn Rogers) I’d sue you for slander. Yup that’s it join the “sue-happy” cult like a little child that cannot get there way. OK WE WILL JUST SUE EVERYBODY FOR EVERYTHING THEY SAY, IF WE DON’T LIKE IT, COMON Joe, you didn’t seem like that type in the beginning.
If you took the time to read in depth my response to you, I “clearly” state that you can bet Lynn Rogers is not recommending that people go out and try to communicate with bears as he does. Anyone involved with this black bear issue knows that Lynn Rogers is not against hunting. He takes no position however, he does not prevent the anti’s from using his name either and they do for anti-hunting purposes.
Researching bears for a hundred years has no bearing on the problems we have in N.J. today. It is not bear research we need it is “political” research so we can take politics out of this issue and allow, like (26) other states do, letting wildlife biologists and Fish&Game do their job.
With classes by our own New Jersey Fish & Wildlife professionals, prior to issuing bear hunting permits, dozens of hunting programs on T.V. and hundreds of Field&Stream, Outdoor Life and other publications, hundreds of DVD’S all on bear hunting no one needs to go to Lynn Rogers to learn how to hunt bears. I doubt many N.J. hunters have done so.
When bears are baited for any purposes of study of course they are in an open zoo like environment. They know that food is put out at specific schedules and they follow those schedules, this was not a critizim of a method of study. Just making it real.
Let me make this clear, it is you that “painted Lynn Rogers as a Whacko PETA Flim Flam man, in your attempt to move the discussion away from the real problem into non-related issues. I never have nor would use these words out of respect for his rights.
All I did was print facts that can be found all over the internet concerning Lynn Rogers. He is allowed to make money from bears and is allowed to be an entrepreneur. Don’t become a story twister because that really, “doesn’t help your cause”.
Interesting, how you never challanged the facts on the success of hunting in the (26) other states that successfully hold hunting seasons to control their black bear populations and danger to humans.
Just pick battles that suit you or ones where you can twist stories.
Calm down Joe, everyone likes Lynn Rogers, knows he is an expert on bears, not an expert however, on black bear problems in N.J. because he is not a pllitician, tractor supply is a great store with great prices, farmers can use whatever priced fencing they see fit their needs.
I am not looking to win debates, I am looking to “educate” the public on a “proven-danger” when politics interferes with wildlife management and the result is a growing population of a dangerous wild animal that cannot possibly continue to be allowed to multiply.
What is going to “backfire” is someone getting seriously injured or killed by a wild black bear that now thrives in a new environment because people like you keep making excuses and misleading statements.
In the long run your side will cause the demise of the black bear in N.J. because if they are not hunted and brought under control, NOW, before they go over the line, then the push to drastically reduce their numbers will be far greater than results of controlled hunts.
We do not need to err on human safety either.
Mike D
Chepo, just received your note today, sorry for the delay in answering. Well let’s see ironically Chepo since your note guess what? Bears have broken into a house in Kinnelon, N.J. and totally thrashed it, broke into a house in Stockholm thrashed it and killed the family pet dog, and just a few days ago, a black bear attacked two boys at a campsite in Stokes Forest.
What really messes this world up are deadbeats like you with the mindset that to quote you; “If you are hungry and can’t find food for your kids and grand kids, wouldn’t you break into a house to
find it?”
I just can’t seem to find a logical relation to the food dilemma of bears and humans, but from the human standpoint I would offer the following:
{Well no, what most people would do was to find some “legal” means to earn money so when they did need food they could pay for it rather than running the risk of going to jail for breaking and entering and stealing someone elses’ property.}
Regarding the black bear:
{Reduce the black bear population to a number that allows for adequate space and food supply based on the availability of their own natural habitat.}
New Jersey has programs in place to preserve forest land through state owned recreational properties, green acres and farmland preservation. This will insure wildlife natural habitat land, but does not mean that any wildlife can be allowed to continually grow to the point of over-population.
We have a black bear overpopulation issue and last years’ hunt was just the beginning of a game management process that will go on for
years before we reduce the black bear population to a safe, co-existing number.
Five hundred and ninety one bears were culled from the N.J. black bear population last year. The recent activity clearly shows that the estimated number of N.J. black bears was very accurate and the need for additional culling through hunts a must.
Now we need the NJDF&W to step up to the plate and change the black bear hunting season to mid-October, November. Starting the bear hunt to coincide with the opening week of the deer gun hunting season is too late.
Just imagine what bear problems we would have at this time if not for the hunt last year.
As for your name calling tirade, means nothing to me and let’s every sensible reader know you have nothing of value to offer on this matter.
We could use some more hunters and people that learn to recognize the nutritional value of healty wildlife as a food source. It would do many good to get out into the woods and back to basics. The forest and streams are part of the freedom our country has offered for decades. The forest offers a get away from the political spin that sucks the life out of us.
At the end of any day in the outdoors, with or without a catch, we can learn the value of freedom, freedom to pursue any legal activity, this is America.
Mike D